Ep. 59: Less, or More?

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Show notes

One of the most important questions we can ask ourselves in this life is: how much is enough? In our home, our relationships, money, work, success, our belongings, what is the value of going bigger, and what are the costs? This week, we talk about how we've been wrestling with this question in our own lives and the surprising contrasts in our desires.

We talked about

  • Laura having a “guest” on the show today

  • a test run event in Monterey at the end of the month for The Art of Wayfinding

  • what’s up with Laura these days and the difference between “The Bigger Yes” program online vs. at Kripalu

  • dishing the dirt on the book we’re reading right now

  • how wanting to believe you’re special can make you susceptible to others’ schemes

  • season 3’s Queer Eye and sexual confusion, criticism of TV therapy, Tan’s at-times bizarre fashion sense, and Karamo’s out-of-this-world beauty

  • the influential 4-Hour Workweek and a fisherman tale to pound the point home

  • a homestead obsession in Meadow’s roaring 20s

  • an ever-changing desire regarding work (and more permanent desires in life generally)

  • Meadow’s simple dream, how she’s essentially already living it, but what she’d still like more of

  • that feeling when you’re doing exactly what you’re born to do

  • how certain things you want can be at odds with what you get

  • arriving at the dream life and still being miserable

  • how “wanting small” not being the same as “playing small”

  • a 9-bag trip to Goodwill and finally thwarting the habit of throwing out half the groceries

  • how turning off your phone can change your life

  • and then some!


“People know what gets them excited. And yet they don’t choose it actively. Sometimes we just want the fantasy.”

“I had kind of arrived at the thing that I thought was the thing...and I was sitting under a palm tree with a freaking margarita, and crying.”

Ask yourself

  • Do you want to go this way (bigger, more) or this way (smaller, less)?

  • What’s the difficulty in making a decision? What would you have to give up?

  • Do you feel you have something big inside of you that you need to express?

  • Why do you want more or less? What would it take?


“The Bigger Yes” program on Laura’s website and at Kripalu

The Great Work of Your Life: A Guide for the Journey of Your True Calling by Stephen Cope

Bad Blood: Secrets and Lies in a Silicon Valley Startup by John Carreyrou

Lost and Found and other books by Geneen Roth

“The Dropout” Podcast

The Righteous Mind: Why Good People are Divided by Politics and Religion by Jonathan Haidt

The 4-Hour Workweek by Tim Ferriss

Company of One: Why Staying Small Is the Next Big Thing for Business by Paul Jarvis
Music by Izzy DeVor.

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Spiritualish, Meadow, and Laura


Spiritualish is hosted by Laura McKowen and Meadow DeVor. Sometimes spiritual, always inappropriate. New episodes drop every Thursday.

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